Tuesday, May 28, 2013

“When I Am Baptized” LDS Song Helps and Ideas

Image courtesy creative commons license flickr.com by Renate Dodell

*I originally published this post 4/19/2012. I'm re-posting this, even though it happened to be one of my most controversial posts. Each year I ask the primary children who are turning 8 why they are baptized and almost all will raise their hand that they are baptized to be forgiven of their sins they have. Hopefully we can teach our children a little better, for of such is the kingdom of heaven.*
 
Hey! So does anyone have a minor qualm with the 2nd verse? My 7 year old brought it up and I quite agree with her "I know when I am baptized, my wrongs are washed away...." Plain and simple, children are clean before the age of 8. The reason they are baptized is to show obedience like the Savior and enter in at the gate as commanded. We decided when we sing it at home we're changing the words to "After I am baptized, my wrongs are washed away (then add in super fast "when I repent!") And I can be forgiven and etc. I know "wrongs" is different from "sins" however Moroni makes it pretty clear "And their little children need no repentance, neither baptism." Yes, absolutely, children need to learn how to recognize mistakes and say I'm sorry... what on earth am I rambling about? Basically, I just like the way we sing it at home better.

Now that I added my 2 cents.....
* Assign different parts of the song to a piece of colored paper. You'll have to write the words on the paper and then put the paper on the blackboard.
Red- I like to look for Rainbows, whenever there is rain
Orange- And ponder on the beauty of an earth made clean again
Yellow- I want my life to be as clean as earth right after rain
Green- I want to be the best I can
Blue- And live with God again!
The whole 2nd verse could be on white paper!
Have children stand up and sing on their favorite color!
Have children stand up when you sing that color if they are wearing that color!!
Have a primary friend come to the front to conduct the song, children stand up on the color they think is that primary friend's favorite! At the end of the song, make sure that primary friend shares what their favorite color is!
Take a poll, by raise of hands, and find out the primary's favorite colors. In order of favorite to least favorite, sing the song... ( For example, Green, Blue, Red, Yellow, Orange... then you'd sing I want to be the best I can, and live with God again, I like to look for rainbows whenever there is rain.... etc)

* You could make simple rainbow ribbon wands for children to conduct and wave with.

* Make a rain stick!! They are so fun!! Invite a primary child to turn on the rain (turn the stick), while it's raining children can gently snap their fingers to add to the rain sound... once the rain is over, we can start to gently sing our song. Easy instructions with nice pictures on how to make a rain stick found HERE.

* Bring in a basket of rainbow colored clothes. Red coat, orange scarf, yellow hat, green shirt... etc. When they learn parts of the song really well, they can dress up a primary friend (or a missionary!) in a rainbow!

In response to some comments, I wrote a follow up post HERE.

49 comments :

Anonymous said...

Remember that not everyone gets baptized at age 8. So while it's true that a recently turned 8 year old doesn't have many "wrongs" to wash away, it's still important that they understand that important part of baptism.

Sofia's Primary Ideas said...

Anonymous- Thank you for your comment. I do know that not everyone gets baptized at 8, but I also know that to teach a child that they have "wrongs" before that age is, well, wrong.

"doesn't have many wrongs to wash away...." Children don't have ANY wrongs to wash away. They are perfect.

Christ said so Himself,
" “Listen to the words of Christ, your Redeemer, your Lord and your God. Behold, I came into the world not to call the righteous but sinners to repentance; the whole need no physician, but they that are sick; wherefore, LITTLE CHILDREN ARE WHOLE, FOR THEY ARE NOT CAPABLE OF COMITTING SIN; wherefore the curse of Adam is taken from them in me, that it hath no power over them.”

A couple years ago, a child, Diegito, came up to me terrified of death. They had seen their grandpa die and thought that it only happened to old people. However, he recently discovered that babies die too. He was so scared as he asked me where I thought the baby went. My baby.

Fear oozed from every feature of Diego's little body. I had been in a state of haze and shock, able to continue and cary on... but at that tender moment I was able to "click" back on. Diego needed to know that he (he was 7 at the time) was precious, he was perfect and that God loved him. He didn't need to fear because Jesus Christ gave His life for him. Should a wise and loving father take a child from this earth into the next life, they would go straight into His arms and live eternally in happiness and peace.

I know exactly where my baby went. Nothing was "wrong" with my baby or any child for that matter UNDER 8.

I've been to A LOT of baptisms and I see a repetitive theme of teaching the children who are about to be baptized that they "will now be clean". Children are clean!! They are the kingdom of heaven and WE are to be like them.

Yes, I completely agree children need to learn that aspect of baptism. However, as we prepare them to enter the gates of baptism while they are under the age of 8, we should in no way make them feel like they are unclean or with sin.
Like singing "my wrongs"...

I could definitely just be too opinionated. Please feel free to share further thoughts. It's my one hot button :) because I have a son who passed away and a Greek Orthodox Yaya who constantly brings up that my baby wasn't baptized!

I always tell my girls, they are what heaven is like. There are no "wrongs" in heaven.

Susan said...

Yeah, I noticed that, too. Glad I'm not the only one. It's technical doctrine for most kids...and I'm impressed your little one picked up on it. You must be an awesome Mom!

Anonymous said...

Children are not without wrongs. When they yell at each other, hit, disobey parents, etc. they are obviously wrong for doing those things. The difference is that children under eight years old are innocent and not responsible for their wrongs because of the atonement of Jesus Christ. They do commit wrongs, but because of the atonement, those wrongs are washed away without the child having to repent. The atonement automatically washes away the wrong. There are many scriptures that say that children need to be baptized for the remission of their sins when eight years old. For example: D&C 86:27. When we turn eight years old we are now accountable for our wrongs. The atonement doesn't automatically wash away our sins anymore like it did before we were eight. Now we have to repent in order to be forgiven. Baptism washes away the wrongs of the innocent children. God doesn't hold children accountable for their wrongs because they have not yet reached the age of accountability, therefore Christ's atonement makes up for those wrongs. This is a beautiful aspect of the atonement. That's why it's blasphemous to baptize a child before they're eight. That would assume that Christ's atonement couldn't wash away the sins of the little child. Please don't change the words of the song. What an opportunity to teach our children (and ourselves) about the far-reaching power of the atonement and baptism!

Shell's Diaries said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Sofia's Primary Ideas said...

Anonymous- Thanks so much for your comments. I wrote a post to help clarify some things. Thank you for this opportunity, I had a wonderful morning with a very powerful spiritual experience as I studied the words of the prophets.

Sister Shells- I love you. I am so very sorry for your loss. I hope we can be breastfeeding buddies in the resurrection together!! Like I mentioned before, I wrote a post to clarify some things. Thank you so very much for taking the time to write and be so gracious.

Anonymous said...

Personally, I think you need to be cautious in revising the words that were meant to be presented in this song. That really isn't our place to do that.
Children make mistakes before the age of 8 and can learn the meaning of being sorry and forgiveness. They are not held accountable, but the renewing of self and having a clean start after baptism is important for them to understand.
Deborah

Anonymous said...

I think this is a great discussion, but I would have to echo the comment that it is not our place to change the words of a song which the General Primary Presidency and Board has prayerfully included in this year's Sacrament Meeting presentation. As a Primary Music Leader, it is my responsibility to prayerfully and humbly teach the assigned songs. Although children under the age of 8 do not need baptism, for their "wrongs" are covered under the condition of the atonement because that is the way our Heavenly Father designed His plan. This song does not go against that idea. I have 5 children, and they have all done things that were "wrong" before the age of 8, regardless of their childlike understandings. So, although little children are not capable of "sinning" they do things occasionally that are "wrong." I think this may be why the song uses the word "wrongs" instead of "sins," because a sin implies full understanding, where a wrong may or may not be intentional. I just pray that I may be able to teach this song with the humility that the Lord would have me have to present such a beautiful message that is such an integral part of our Heavenly Father's plan.

Sofia's Primary Ideas said...

JAACS- You are HOT. H.O.T. HOT.

Sister Karan- It's nice to know I'm not alone! Thank you so much for your wonderful wonderful words!! You really are too kind.

Sister Deborah- Thanks for your comment! I always will do things in my home that help clarify or make things understandable to my kiddos. In fact, we added a whole new verse to the wise man & the foolish man

So build your house upon the rock!
Build your house upon the rock!
Build your house upon the rock!
The rock is Jesus Christ!

Also, children don't have a clean start after baptism because they were clean beforehand.

As mothers aren't we entitled to receive revelation for our families? So isn't it kind of our place?

Anonymous- Thank you also for your comment!

Did you know that recently the most perfect book on earth was changed? The Book of Mormon! It was a large change too! The scriptures that talked about "cursings of black skin" were removed. Isn't that marvelous? No longer do beautiful brown skinned or black skinned people have to wonder if their heritage was marred by cursings and wickedness.

Change can be good. Change can be necessary. I think there is a big difference between changing the words in this song to help a child at home understand verses blatantly disregarding the prophets and apostles and doing your own thang. It's a fine line I'm sure!

Anonymous said...

Are you in favor of changing the words to teach in Primary? Or just at home? Just curious.
Also, under no circumstances can you relate the Prophet revising things and you revising things. There should be no such comparison there, AT ALL!!
I believe your heart is in the right place, but you cannot change things given to us by our leaders. Some get into big problems doing such.
Also, I have heard this song many, many times and never interpreted it the way you seem to. I never saw it as saying, "at the moment of baptism," I see it as, "after taking that step."

Sofia's Primary Ideas said...

Anonymous- I'm in favor of you not harrassing me, as brothers and sisters not trying to be contentious, & the English synthpop duo Erasure. Woot! Woot!

Anonymous said...

I appreciate all of your comments and got a lot more than I bargained for when I was looking for help in teaching this beautiful song :) Your comments definitely made me think. I'm always naturally drawn to this topic because I too lost a baby boy just after birth several years ago. I know children who die before the age of accountability are as Moroni says "Alive in Christ" they have no need of baptism or repentance to receive salvation. This beautiful doctrine just made me appreciate the Atonement so much more. I think the word "wrongs" in the second verse was used purposefully. My 6 year old definitely knows some things she does are wrong and she can choose right from wrong in a lot of cases. The key though is that she is not accountable for those wrongs. Children don't sin because they are not accountable (yet) for their bad choices. But they are practicing with our help on how to say sorry when they hurt others just like repentance. So when they're baptized they can feel clean, not because they were unclean before (because they weren't), but because they are new, and they are now accountable for the choices they will make. I taught the song in our primary today and left the 2nd verse the way it was written and it was a good teaching opportunity to talk about accountability and repentance. Thank you all for making me think and ponder on these things because I've wondered them in the past.

Wendell said...

@ Sofia's Primary Ideas
The Book of Mormon scriptures were not recently revised in a significant way as you claim. The chapter headings of some chapters were altered in the online version of the Book of Mormon. The actual scriptural content remains unaltered. Everyone on earth has a heritage marred by cursing and wickedness, so brown-skinned people shouldn't feel any worse than anybody else about theirs anyway.

Sofia's Primary Ideas said...

Anonymous- I got a lot more than I bargained for when I uttered a simple prayer- Lord, how can I help my children and possibly others learn this beautiful song and truly love it. He definitely works in mysterious ways!!

I'm so sorry for the loss of your son. Perhaps we can be breastfeeding buddies in the resurrection! I'm happy this post brought us together, even though I don't know your name. I really appreciated all your words and thoughts. They were beautiful. Most of the comments given here are so insightful and wonderful. There are so many great people out there. I just wish it didn't have to be online. I'd much rather do it the Greek way, get out the spit, roast some meat, dance, talk & enjoy some baklava over good conversation.



Brother Wendell- May I call you Brotha Wendell? You can call me Sofia, or possibly Selena.

You may not think it's a significant change. You're entitled to your opinion. For anyone that's interested, the changes that I think are big and exciting (& again, that's just my opinion... I'm in no way telling anyone to agree or disagree with me- just sharing info.) can be found here:

http://www.blacklds.org/changes-to-lds-scripture-headings-footnotes

Wendell. Sigh. I think we run a dangerous line telling people what they should or shouldn't "feel".

For me personally, I don't think I ever could have understood being denied the powers of heaven and blessings of exaltation just because I was born a certain color. Black saints are SAINTS with a capital S-A-I-N-T-S!!!! I admire them for all they have been through and continue to do so by just being Black and Mormon. Shout out to my hot African American hubby and best friend!!!

Sofia's Primary Ideas said...

Here's an interesting read for anyone who is interested in the topic of Blacks and The Priesthood... It came up because of a BYU professor who issued a statement to the Washington Post that wasn't in harmony with Church teachings. It really is a beautiful read, Brother Gray is an inspiration. It also has some information about Mitt Romney.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/the-genesis-of-a-churchs-stand-on-race/2012/02/22/gIQAQZXyfR_story.html

Anonymous said...

Children are innocent in that they are not accountable not that they don't make mistakes. D&C 68:27 tell us "And their children shall be baptized for the remission of their sins when eight years old, and receive the laying on of the hands." The doctrine is sound in this song, and has been approved by the First Presidency.

Joyful Mom said...

Love your idea of teaching the song with the phrases on different colors of paper and the idea of looking at a rainbow of colors as the children sing. That's a beautiful way to remember. I like how you can create a game of it by singing the phrase of your favorite color or for the color you are wearing,etc.

I feel like a should add to the discussion that the Savior's atonement encompasses our pains, affflictions, temptations, sicknesses, death, infirmities, sins, and transgressions (see Alma 7:11-13). Children can experience many of those things before the age of 8. To say they are perfect implies they don't need the atonement, but it's because of the Savior's perfect and infinite atonement on their behalf that little children are able to return straight to our Heavenly Father.

Sofia's Primary Ideas said...

Joyful Mom- Thanks so much for your input and kind words!! I also understand and am so grateful for that aspect of the atonement. I don't know if saying someone is perfect implies they don't need the atonement. Gen 6:9 says Noah was a just and perfect man, however we know he needed the atonement. Job was also described as perfect Job 1:1, we know he needed the atonement. We all need the atonement. As far as I understand children being perfect, it's because they don't have sin and are pure and clean... however, of course, we all need the atonement. The atonement has many aspects as you said. Elder McKonkie said, "Those who are not accountable for sins never fall spiritually and need not be redeemed from a spiritual fall which they never experienced." Children need the atonement to overcome physical death, as well as like you mentioned, possibly to have comfort in their pains and afflictions. Joyful Mom, I'm a joyful mom too. We're so blessed. Thank you so much for adding that great scripture. One cannot help but read that scripture and have a deep moment of gratitude. Thank you for making my day even better!

Anonymous said...

Just another quick thought about the idea of our children's wrongs being washed away...If children are accountable from the time they are 8 years old and they are unable to get baptized until they are 8 and we all sin daily, then couldn't it be that EVERY 8 year old has actually sinned by the time they go into the waters and are baptized? I enjoyed reading all of the comments. They all made me think. I have come to the final conclusion though that this is an inspired verse that does not teach false doctrine. I'm pretty sure that it is a very rare case when an 8 year old gets baptized right as he/she turns 8 or before they have made a mistake since they were officially 8, hence the need to now officially be washed clean even though not many hours or days before they were automatically cleansed. Hopefully that makes sense.

Sofia's Primary Ideas said...

Anonymous- First of all, thank you for the way you put your comment. It feels friendly. I see what you are saying, I think... like if a child's birthday is April 30 and their baptism date is May 7. Right? So those days inbetween they could have possibly sinned.

Let's think about it this way. Do we think the child would be denied exaltation should they die May 3?? Because they "might" have sinned?? Only God really knows. Brother McKonkie really clarifies that question though,
"Accountability does not burst full-bloom upon a child at any given moment in his life. Children become accountable gradually, over a number of years. Becoming accountable is a process, not a goal to be attained when a specified number of years, days, and hours have elapsed."

But I think we're missing the big picture. He has likened the kingdom of heaven to a little child. If the kingdom of heaven is clean, which we know it is, then so are little children. Words that have been used by prophets and apostles to describe children inclue, "spotless, pure, clean, without sin".

I wrote a post with many scriptures and words of modern day apostles on the subject. I just linked the post.

I just want to reiterate:
1. I am in no way saying this 2nd verse is teaching false doctrine.
2. My child was confused by the wording, so we clarified things at home.
3. Jesus is awesome.

Tina said...

Love the fun way you taught this song!!! As far as the words go, I think it is on purpose that the composer (or whoever) chose the word "wrongs" vs. the word "sins." Not everything we do "wrong" is a "sin." I really appreciate the extra thought process I got while reading this post . . . . . thanks for the food for thought!

I won't be checking back for comments to my comments so just my 2 cents.

Nick and Kelly said...

I love the song idea! It is so fun and I am excited to try it! We wanted to add our two cents about the "wrongs". Children can make mistakes and do things that are "wrong", but they are not sins because they don't begin to be accountable until age 8.

Sofia's Primary Ideas said...

Sister Tina- Thanks for adding to the discussion! You have a beautiful smile by the way!

Sister Kelly- Thank you also for your comments! I completely agree.

I think where there is confusion is that are children's wrongs washed away at the point of baptism? And the answer is NO because baptism is for the remission of sins and because children are pure, no matter how many wrongs they have made before the age of 8.

Tina said...

Sister Sophia . . . . OKAY! you made me check back!!! thanks for the visit to my blog, your comment, and you compliment . . . it has made my day! :)

Anonymous said...

Sofia,

I appreciate your defense of children and your passion for them. I feel like the issue may be that everyone that has posted also feels the same way. From the comments posted I don't feel that anyone disagrees with when children are accountable. The concern for me is the advice you are giving to change the song because the doctrine is "misleading or incorrect"- It isn't and I think this may be striking people the wrong way and to be honest is taking credibility away from the blog. I don't think that is your intention, but I do feel that it is unnecessary to continue to defend when children are accountable when that doesn't seem to be the concern people are having. The concern I have personally is advising people to change the words of an approved song. In doctrine and covenants it says clearly "And their children shall be baptized for the remission of their sins when eight years old, and receive the laying on of the hands (D&C 68:27)." This isn't in conflict of when children are accountable, it does give scriptural reference for the song. I guess what I'm trying to say is we all agree here, children are precious andloved. I don't have any intention of being confrontational or hurtful in any way. I have really enjoyed your blog with it's fun and creative ideas. I believe that you have a tremendous love for the gospel and children.

Sofia's Primary Ideas said...

Sister Tina- Seriously... you look like one of those beautiful moms that should model for picture frame pictures!

Anonymous- You know the sad thing is for every negative thing a person says, it takes like 10 positives to erase. I appreciate all the kind things you've said, but other comments of yours really stung.

"The concern for me is the advice you are giving to change the song because the doctrine is "misleading or incorrect"- "
Can you please tell me anywhere where I remotely told people to change the words? Read carefully.

"It isn't and I think this may be striking people the wrong way and to be honest is taking credibility away from the blog." That's a really hurtful comment.

"The concern I have personally is advising people to change the words of an approved song." Again, read very carefully... no where have I told anyone to change the lyrics.

"In doctrine and covenants it says clearly "And their children shall be baptized for the remission of their sins when eight years old, and receive the laying on of the hands (D&C 68:27)." I wrote a whole post with scriptures and words of the apostles that children DO NOT have SIN (under the age of 8) therefore they can NOT be baptized for the remission of sins. They are pretty clear also, but I'm not sure if you read them. However, I'll just quote one
"How and why are they (little children) saved? They are saved through the atonement and because they are free from sin" So how can a little child be baptized for the remission of sin if they don't have sin? The D&C verse is probably referring/inferring to after baptism, they can have remission of sin when they repent and partake of the sacrament. Just like the 2nd verse of the song.

"I don't have any intention of being confrontational or hurtful in any way." Love you mang, Love you. If you ever feel like sharing your name, are in Reno and want some herbal mint tea... email me and we will hug it out.

Anonymous said...

Sophia,

I apologize, my intention wasn't to hurt your feelings and but I see that I did. I appreciate your wonderful ideas and creative talents that you share. I have loved and used many in teaching. I hope you will forgive me for the hurt that I have caused. I know you put yourself out there for others with your blog, and am truly sorry.

Rochelle said...

Sofia,
Thank you so much for all you do to help us with our primary callings. I'm sorry that some people have been hurtful in their reactions to your honest and open questioning. You made me stop and think for a while about this and I'm glad for the chance to ponder and listen to the spirit and read others' great insights. I am so glad that through the Internet we can all converse and learn from one another. I'm sure that no one of us has a perfect understanding of all things, but I am very grateful that you spend so much time and thought pondering the gospel. I know I and my primary have benefitted greatly.

Rush said...

I've always had issue w/that, too! and w/ people telling 8-year-olds at their baptism about how clean they are now. Thank you for sharing your thoughts, and the SCRIPTURES and Christ's words on this matter. I am so grateful for it!

Anonymous said...

Hello,

The comments have been very interesting to read, thank you. I think it is necessary for this verse to be expanded on in order for it to be properly understood, and luckily as members we have the knowledge and capability to do so. My interpretation of verse 2 is as follows (for anyone who cares):

I know when I am baptised [and hereafter become a Member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, are capable of sin, and in need of the Atonement of Christ to repent]:

1. My wrongs are washed away;
2. I can be forgiven; and
3. Improve myself each day

The words 'are', 'can', and 'improve' must refer to the Atonement and its power to wash away wrongdoings and sins, forgive, and help us to improve ourselves as we repent from the day of baptism onwards (were it not so then the words wouldnt talk about improving oneself 'each day', for we cant be physically baptised daily but we can repent each day through the Atonement). Surely one could not assume such things as being forgiven or able to be improved each day just by being physically baptised otherwise?
The fact that the verse continues to talk about life as a whole and even afterward ('I want my LIFE to be as clean as Earth right after rain/I want to be the best I can, and LIVE WITH GOD AGAIN' emphasis added) proves to me that the verse isnt talking about past wrongs being washed away at the point of baptism for an 8 year old, but continually throughout life as a member of the Church through repentance and the Atonement of Christ.

I might be way off but this is what makes sense to me. If my child had trouble understanding the song then I wouldnt have a problem adding an extra line to it during family home evening just as I would liken a scripture unto ourselves so we as a family can get more out of it, though I wouldnt make changes at Church or other activities that include other peoples' kids.

Thanks!

Michelle said...
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Michelle said...

Thanks for this idea! It helped me! I just wanted to say that I agree, I don't think you once said that we should change the lyrics to the verse. While I personally, don't feel it is my place to change lyrics in primary that have been prayerfully and spiritually included. I do feel that every mother and father has the right to decide for themselves what is right for their family and household. So, go you!

I feel that you are right when you said "As mothers aren't we entitled to receive revelation for our families?" Obviously not to be compared to the priesthood holders abilities. Here is an example of a recent way this has helped me.


I, my husband and the kids went hiking last week, we came upon this rock incline. Once we were headed up it became much more steep. We got to the top and we continued on the trail. As we continued the trail got thinner and thinner and very close to a steep cliff face. I had this horrible feeling and these words kept going through my head "go back, go back!". I told my husband about my feeling and even though the kids wanted to continue, he immediately said "ok guys we are heading back. Mom received a feeling and when the Holy Ghost tells us something, we listen."

I don't know what would have happened had we stayed there but, I know I am so grateful for the insights we get for our families and that I have a wonderful husband who understands and supports them.

You are awesome! Keep up the good work!

Savanna said...

Our Stake Primary leaders have started emphasizing this point with 8 year olds. They are not accountable so they have no sins. Thanks for the post!

Sofia's Primary Ideas said...

Sister Savanna- Thanks for sharing! Hope you have a great day!

Anonymous said...

You all need to go get a job, you have too much time on your hands! Give it a rest, people. Go start your own church if you disagree with the primary leadership!Nobody even wants to hear any of this, we are just looking at ways to teach the CORRECT words of the song. If you feel so strongly about this you should take it up with the general board instead of gossiping about it on these websites. Let THEM school you, instead of your standing on your soapbox.

Sofia's Primary Ideas said...

Anonymous- I don't mean to go Gandhi on you... but I do.
"Anger and intolerance are the enemies of correct understanding."

Please don't insult my readers. Take a deep breath and think before you speak. Are you acting in a Christ like manner?

Have a good day anonymous.

Dunson Family said...

Thank you for all of the time you put into this blog and for sharing it with others. This might seem a bit silly but you have got me thinking. I understand that children who are under age 8 have no sin. When you get baptized aren't you 8 already? I've never been to a baptism where it was the child's birthday. That means you probably have sinned and that your sins do need to be washed away. Right? Please gently lead me back if I have the wrong idea. (Putting myself out there.)

Sofia's Primary Ideas said...

Sister Dunson- Nothing is silly when we're chatting together! Thank you for your compliment and question. Another friend, had the same one. I'll address it with a quote from The Ensign from Elder Bruce R. McKonkie. I highly suggest, if you really want to think about it, that you read my follow up post I linked to this post.

Basically, if a child is 8 years old and 1 week before they get baptized are the sins they committed in that week washed away at baptism.
"Accountability does not burst full-bloom upon a child at any given moment in his life. Children become accountable gradually, over a number of years. Becoming accountable is a process, not a goal to be attained when a specified number of years, days, and hours have elapsed."

The bigger question lies in your testimony of God the Father and The Savior. Do you feel like they would not permit a child to enter into the Kingdom of Heaven if they died at 8 years old and 6 days... a day before their baptism?

Sister Lyons- Hello! Thanks for your question. I'll shoot back with one, if you don't mind. Why did Christ, who was perfect, get baptized?

What I told my daughter specifically:
1. Obedience, it's a commandment
2. To do the Father's will
3. To show love for Christ and our Father
4. For the remission of sins after baptism
5. To make and keep the baptismal covenant
6. It's the preparatory step to receiving the Holy Ghost and being blessed with one of the greatest gifts God has given us
7. And because it's absolutely essential for our entering the Kingdom of God

Thank you so much ladies!! I really appreciate the kind manner in which you asked them. Sometimes I really wonder why I'm being attacked over church doctrine,(And not by you guys!!!) but in the long run I'm just grateful to be able to share my finds in the scriptures and words of the apostles. I know that anyone who reads over things and prays will find a testimony of the truth.

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Anonymous said...

Newly Created Verse 1.5:
I know when I am baptized, I covenant with the Lord: to keep all His commandments and share my brother's load.

Existing Chorus.

Revised Verse 2:
I know when CONVERTS BAPTIZE, THEIR wrongs are washed away. And THEY can be forgiven and improve THEMSELVES each day.

Revised Final Chorus:
THEY want THEIR lives to be as clean as earth right after rain. THEY want to be the best THEY can and live with God again.

Sofia's Primary Ideas said...

Hello Anonymous- Thank you for sharing. I'd just like to state before someone starts raving, I do NOT recommend changing the words of the song at church.

What do I recommend? Stargirl. By Jerry Spinelli.

Sofia's Primary Ideas said...

Also, for my friend who deleted all their comments, I hope you know that I am in no way shape or form offended by what you said. I'm hoping that you looked up things and found the correct answers. (Specifically refer to Article of Faith #2) I do speak regularly with my Bishop. He's a great guy. And really, I hope you have a wonderful wonderful summer!!

Wooooo!!!! Pool time!!

Anonymous said...

Aussie Primary Pres: Wow! what a thought provoking discussion.

Eric said...

I've also been bothered by the suggestion that children need their wrongs washed away. You're not alone. You bring up the question about those slightly over age 8 as to whether or not they would be denied salvation if they were not baptized. I think that answer is emphatically yes. However, the Lord has provided a plan whereby all can be baptized who accept it. The Eight-year-and one-day-old must be baptized. Whether that is to have their sins washed away or just to enter they gate, I'll leave that to the judge of us all.

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